The Second Commissions Poll

[sigune]

sugarplumkitten asked me about commissions today, and I thought I'd post another poll to find out a bit more about the expectations of those people who are considering ordering a picture with me.

My previous poll brought to light that 9 readers of my journal are definitely interested in commissioning a picture; on top of that, 8 more are interested if the prices are reasonable :D.

Now, as you well know, my artwork (doesn't that sound ponderous and self-important?) is not digital; it's invariably done the old-fashioned way with pens, pencils, paint, markers and whatever on paper or cardboard. That means that when a drawing changes hands, it is forever gone from me. I am not sure how understandable this is in view of the relatively limited artistic value of my scribbles (they're not Picassos, right?), but to me, definitively handing over something that I have created with love and patience is not an easy thing. I can do it, when I know from the start that I am working for someone else; but it is obvious to me that an original is going to be sold at a higher price than a print or scan of which the original stays with me.

In view of the concerns about price, then, I would like to hear from you what kind of an image you would expect; if different options get checked, I will consider them and make different prices.

Secondly, I would also like to hear what attitude you take towards commissioned art at all - what kind of freedom or limits you would set to the person who does a drawing for you.

Please help me out and take the poll! Advice, concerns, comments are very welcome :).

[Poll #785586]

Comments

[sscrewdriver.livejournal.com]

I've both commissioned and won artworks in the past and I've provided quite a lot of information about what I wanted in the picture, but left the style entirely up to the artist - after all, that's why they're the artist, right?

I've collaborated closely along the way, receiving initial sketches etc, swopping quite a few e-mails about details. I've found that the more information I've provided not only about the clothing, backgrounds, actions etc of the characters but the emotions that they are feeling, the easier it is for the artist. During the last artwork I was told that the artist felt freed by the level of detail that I supplied and it actually inspired her. Which was very nice.

I've always been delighted by whatever I've received in the end.

I have never yet received an original artwork and I would expect to pay considerably more for one, (perhaps double?) especially for one of Sigune's. Usually I just copy them off DA or receive them by e-mail. But I might buy one in the future. It would have to be arranged clearly in advance. At the moment I'm quite happy getting them digitally.

[sigune.livejournal.com]

LOL! I'm just worried that if people start adding specifications like, "there's a bed over there, and the characters are sitting on a sofa in such and such a way", I just won't be able to do that, technically. I have a lot of shortcomings, and the only reason why my art looks good, if it does look good, is that I'm apt at evading all sorts of settings and poses that I can't get to work. I also appear to be quite bad at depicting something that I can't sympathise with myself - like SS/HG :/. That's a bit of a disadvantage if you take commissions, isn't it?

I don't want to scare people off, but I would like to know what things to warn them about :D. It's horrible: I'm an amateur, but I think I have the quirks of a real artist.

I would swap sketches, certainly, and invite comments on the early stages of the drawing. As for scans, I'm not sure what's best... For line art, if you want it printed and looking decent, you need a resolution of 800 dpi; that seems to make for quite a heavy file to attach to an e-mail :/. I'll have to experiment with that sort of thing, I suppose.

[lunafish.livejournal.com]

I definitely couldn't imagine asking you for a pic of SS/HG, lol! But I think that many artists refuse commisions (or have their commisions refused when the buyer finds that the artist doesn't depict what was hoped for). I think most people expect artists to have preferences about what they wish to work on.

[sigune.livejournal.com]

I was unacquainted with the commissions system until I joined LJ, really. That is - I know that before photography, rich and influential people used to commission their portraits from painters, and I am familiar with classical patronage and such, but I wasn't aware there was something popular and similar in fandom :D. I still find it odd myself. For me, buying art is about going someplace where finished pictures are on display, and when you see one that you love very much, you ask the price, barter a bit, and buy it if you think you can't live without it. But to seek out an artist and ask them to make something specific for me - it had never crossed my mind, and now that I know about it, I think I still wouldn't do it :D. Not that there's anything wrong with it, mind; it's just -

Your commission was basically that: you saw a sketch and an idea that you liked; it was there already and you paid me to finish it. It's not the same as when you would have walked up to me and said, "I have such and such an idea in my head, would you please picture it for me?", which seems to be what most people expect to do. Basically what someone who commissions wants is their mental imaged transferred onto paper by someone else in apparently as accurate a way as possible. That's where I become slightly nervous, because I'm not sure I can live up to that.

I put in the "more interested in the style than in the subject / more interested in the subject than in the style" question because I had a sneaking suspicion that people who commission fanart care more about what's in the picture than about how it looks. Me, I'd be the opposite. If I am proud about anything when drawing, it is about how I depict something more than about what I depict - like my writing, actually :D. I'm also much more inclined to like/love/buy something because it's the work of a particular artist than because it depicts a specific subject that I happen to like, though a combination of both would of course be ideal :).

I'm probably too serious again, as usual; but the poll results do show that my basic attitude towards art is very different from that of most people who consider commissioning me, and I find that very interesting.

[ani-bester.livejournal.com]

One thing I do to help me part with originals is make a copy for myself.
I don't consider this wrong because no one pays enough to own the exclusive rights to any picture =P

Depending on what the person paid for, I send the print or the original.

As far as commissions go, when i commission an artist I like to leave as much to the artist as possible because part of my interest is seeing the artists interpretation. I usually specify character and some atmosphere, occasionally an object (with Seviet a requested something be in teh background to indicate Peter was in a medical field, she put in a book, which was cool)

When I take commissions, I prefer the person to know what they want. I don't mind if they are very specific or leave it all to me, but I had a person leave it to me then change their minds after I showed 'em the prelim sketch. That irked me all to hell. First it was whatever you want, then it was laying on a rug, with a fireplace, in next to nothing, with this, that and the other thing. I wasted so much time on the first sketch -_-

However, showing people my preliminary sketch is an easy way to let the buyer sign off on the unchangable inked and color version. Since I have to do a sketch anyway, I might as well let 'em know what's up.

[seaislewitch.livejournal.com]

Hi! I've seen your work around, and it's lovely!

I think seeing a preliminary sketch would be helpful from a commissioner's point of view (me), especially if it is the first time with an artist or if it's a medium that cannot be changed.

[sigune.livejournal.com]

Yes, I agree about showing the drawing at the sketch stage; that seems very sensible and the best way of discussing the particulars. After that, it's too late to change much (if anything).

I sometimes make multiple versions of pictures, just to try things out; I don't think I've ever copied for the sake of having a copy. I'm not sure I could do the same thing twice. But I've changed my habit of inking over the original sketch in favour of transfering the drawing to a fresh sheet of paper, at least :).

I'm just going to be so nervous about the commission thing. Sometimes I have very definite views of how something should look... But the again, it may be easier than I sometimes think, because after all it's not the same as doing a spontaneously inspired picture. You start from someone else's idea. It's sort of exciting :).

Do you feel differently about commissions and your spontaneous work?

[ani-bester.livejournal.com]

Ohh multiple pictures? I've done thumbnails a few times. It kinda dempends how firm a look is in my head. I almost never draw on the original sketch for art if I want it to be relaly finished.

I'm such a messy sketcher and I press down so hard it's nearly impossible to fully erase! Usually I transfr clean lines onto better paper, which accuunts for the subtle changes from one to the other.

As far as commissions, got I'm obnoxiously slow with them because if I am atall dissatisfied I don't want to go on. I aklmost prefer getting cheap sketch commissions because then I can get past thef laws. I've had three 100.00 commissions and CHRIST I hated it. I was so anal.

In fact I've been sitting on one for over a year now because I can not get something that I feel right charing that much for. Of course, irony is, 100.00 is still damn cheap as far as real life art prices go -_-

I still hate the megatokyo artisti for being able to sell his cheap ass sketches or 3,000 (heck his entire comic is still sketches! It's all pencil work with the friggen GUIDELINES still visible and he can do something even sketchier than THAT and make that much *dies*. Artistic Jealousy!!)

I also really hate mailing things because I always work past post ffice hours and I don't trust their internet stuff. It's really hard to get things out, but most people, I've found, seem to want the real thing unless they just really love your art.

[sigune.livejournal.com]

It's strange, isn't it? On the one hand I feel guilty about asking friends money for something I make for them, but on the other, the price I ask doesn't nearly cover the hours of work that went into a drawing. I don't think anybody on my flist would be willing to pay the real price of a picture. Of course, you can say that I should just spend less time on one; but like you, I wouldn't want to sell a picture with which I am not entirely happy - I'd be getting money for it after all. I know that to keep agonising over it is no good, but I couldn't possibly sell something that I know is inferior. I often wonder how artists who really get a heap of money for one of their works feel about that. I'm quite sure that they see flaws that others can't see.

I think the trouble with art and pricing is that you can only really make money with art as soon as people are willing to pay more than your materials and your hours - when they recognise something wonderful in a line or an idea and want to reward your creativity because it's unique. Most artists can only dream of getting that sort of recognition :D. And those who do get it don't always seem worthy of it either ;) (yay, artistic jealousy!!). Who is that 3,000 dollar guy, btw?!

[sscrewdriver.livejournal.com]

I'm just worried that if people start adding specifications like, "there's a bed over there, and the characters are sitting on a sofa in such and such a way", I just won't be able to do that, technically.

I don't think you really need worry about that. People know your style and that's why they commission from you. But of course you are going to worry about it, and that's why the art turns out well, because of the level of care taken.

On the one hand I feel guilty about asking friends money for something I make for them, but on the other, the price I ask doesn't nearly cover the hours of work that went into a drawing.

I get this too. I must admit to not cashing cheques from friends in the past. It's almost better to do art for acquaintences! It helps keep a level of professionalism. But most artists have this problem - because artists love their work so much that they are willing to do it for free a lot of the time and because non-artists have no idea of the sheer hours of time it takes to make a piece.

[dragonaries.livejournal.com]

If you would commission a picture from me, you would:

If you really would prefer to keep the original image, I would ask for a highly detailed scan of it but given the opportunity to ask for a second commission in the future and be able to get the original print. (I love originals!)

When you commission a picture, you:

There were a few things listed on the items available but I didn't see the one I mostly would want. I would like to indicate if it's happy (not necessarily fluff but opposed to depressing/angsty), angsty, or general art. I prefer art that is not all that angsty when commissioning something.

But the items below apply too:
are happy to set a subject and let the artist determine all the rest
are more interested in the subject than in the style
want to determine the materials used (pencil, paint, inks...) -- (I love your ink work!)

Now for the returned question - when are you going to start taking commissions approximately? hehe (And starts to think about subjects.)

[sigune.livejournal.com]

:D
I set November as my date; I'll make an official announcement though ;).

I would like to indicate if it's happy (not necessarily fluff but opposed to depressing/angsty), angsty, or general art.
That's a good point. I hadn't thought about it when I wrote the poll, but yes, I can definitely see you'd want to clarify the general atmosphere :).

I don't have a problem with selling an original per se; I just sold one to lunafish. It's just that it's going to be more expensive than a scan, whether or not on a disc. I'll have to make different options available; for some reason it usen't to occur to me that sometimes people aren't really dying to get a paper version of a picture :D.

[seaislewitch.livejournal.com]

I've commissioned a lot of art. I always have something in mind because I want the art to illustrate a scene from one of my stories. Now, that said, I commission that particular artist because I like their style. I want their style, but with the characters and scene of my choosing. If I were to commission you, Sigune, I'd provide a written scene and details like how old the characters are, what sort of clothing they are wearing (unless the artist has a particular style of clothing that they draw for a particular character - Snape's robes, for instance.), where they are looking, body language, etc.

I'd want the artist to be open to change something, if I wasn't satisfied. That works with digital art. (After seeing one picture I commissioned, I realised that Pansy should be looking into Draco's eyes, not at something else. The artists changed it easily because it was digital art.) For a hand drawn picture, I should know that things can't be changed going into it, so communication would be key.

Also, if I know the artist or their work well, it's easier to understand what I'll be getting. So, you may want to start with people you know best...like me!

I'd only expect an email with jpeg attached. If I want a print of it, I can print it at home or take the file somewhere locally for a better result.

[sigune.livejournal.com]

The thing I worry about is - perhaps wrongly - that you (or anyone else who commissions) might ask for something that I can't do. I mean, I know you often commission Perselus, who is really good at backgrounds and interiors. I'm absolutely not, so I hope you wouldn't expect the same things from me that you expect from her :D. I'm simply nervous about people ignoring my weaknesses. That's probably silly because I suppose that anyone who browses through my gallery will have some idea of what they can expect. But still; I did at least one picture with which the recipient wasn't happy, and I knew it but couldn't get it any better than that :(. I felt bad about it.

I think that when it comes to scans I will have to find out what's best. Line art is a bit tricky when it comes to printing; my comic required very heavy 800dpi GIF files. But then I suppose that if I sent you a jpeg and you wrote me to say it didn't look good, I could just make new ones until the result is what it's supposed to be :).

[seaislewitch.livejournal.com]

WHEN you finally take on my commission, I want YOUR style. Black on white. (Although I do like your coloured Brunhild in that avatar!)

I'd be a good first patron, you know.

[sigune.livejournal.com]

I'd be a good first patron, you know.

*grins*
I trust so!

[sigune.livejournal.com]

PS: I'm practising my Pansies ;).

[seaislewitch.livejournal.com]

Ahhh....perfect!

PS I love the proper Slytherin linen you gave me (while I was a bit tipsy)! Pansy would approve.

[veradee.livejournal.com]

While I would prefer an original drawing, I have to admit that money would have to come into play so that I probably would opt for a scan instead.

Well, I would like to have a drawing of your Snape and therefore would expect the trademarks, that is the eyebrows, the robes and pointy shoes you draw him with. I wouldn't give any too detailed information on what the subject (apart from Snape) should be although I rather like the idea of vaguely depicting a scene of one from my stories. I would like to have a say about the materials.

[sigune.livejournal.com]

Snape? That would be easy ;).

It's funny: when I draw something spontaneously, I usually have a good idea of which materials I am going to use; a picture usually suggests it by itself. But when Lunafish commissioned "Intimacy", she asked specifically for pencils, which I wouldn't have considered myself, and her request determined the entire look and feel of the final picture, making me very happy in the end that she did ask for pencils :D. I suppose ideally a commission is an interaction where both parties inspire each other, or something of the kind :).

[septemberrains.livejournal.com]

With regard to the question on what I would expect from a commission: I ticked the paper copy option but really my expectation would depend on what I had agreed with the artist and how much I was paying.

If I was commissioning art with a view to framing it and putting it on display then I would expect the original paper copy but I was also expect to pay a higher price.

If I was commissioning art simply to accompany a fanfiction or for personal viewing pleasure rather than display in my home then I would be perfectly happy with a hi-res scan.

I'm not familiar with the DeviantArt option but it sounds like an interesting alternative for people who don't have access to high quality printing facilities at home.

[sigune.livejournal.com]

Well, as concerns deviantART, I was also thinking about shipping. Anything that comes directly from me must ship from Europe; dA ships from the States, which would be a lot cheaper for most people.

It's funny for me to see how many people would be happy with a scan. I'd never expected it :D. I clearly have a lot to learn about commissioning...

[lunafish.livejournal.com]

Speaking as a recipient of one of your original paper drawings, I'd definitely go for that! I love seeing your work on-line and was happy to have the digital version, but actually holding the original in my hands and feeling and seeing the wonderful texture...well, it was an entirely different experience altogether! And yes I'd be willing to pay extra--above what I did for the last one--to cover the postage and handling. (I'm thinking that Luna of yours would be really nice to have.... ;)

And I definitely believe in letting the artist go her own way, though it probably helped that I was inspired by one of your already existing sketches to ask about a commision. Still, everything I've seen of yours I've really liked, and even loved in some cases. I suppose I'd just let you know what I had in mind, and then you could tell me yes or no.

[sigune.livejournal.com]

In the case of your drawing, a scan could never do justice to the paper; it isn't as pretty as the original, and I don't think it would look that nice if you printed it. But then when I chose the paper, I already knew you wanted the original and not just a scan; that's the sort of thing I would definitely take into account.

It's true, your commission wasn't difficult at all - that is, no more difficult than the things I would have had to do if I had just kept the picture for myself :D. You gave me the most amazing compliment by asking for something I had already worked out; it makes me feel very appreciated. I'm doubly glad to have met you - I am happy and honoured that my picture lives with such a wonderful woman now :).

[lunafish.livejournal.com]

Thanks, Sigune. I feel pretty honored myself.

About the paper: I think that is one of the things I really like about having the original version. Non-electronic media adds a certain dimension to a picture that one really can't get in a computerized version, I think. Texture, depth...I don't know what words you artists would use. I just like it.

My Music Video Project

[kilyle.livejournal.com]

I'm so glad that I found this site. I'm VERY new to LiveJournal and I found this from a couple redirects after a link in the SugarQuill. That comic is great! I look forward to more.

I've been working out details for a project sometime in the future: a music video based on a Snape fanfic (Bittersweet, by Dazzleberry). Thing is, fanfic, so no footage. Obviously it won't be an animated video, but mostly stills and pans. I could finagle a couple very simple semi-animated shots, e.g., placing a chess piece on a board, opening a door to a room, etc.

I've debated about drawing my own (I'm decent on art but no so good on consistent characters). At length I thought that I would seek out potential artists and see what was available (and what, I hope, won't bankrupt me). And if I can get a good artist to work out the money shots, I could probably draw the rest myself based on the character designs given (fairly good at that). Also, I could take some character shots and give them backgrounds myself. So there's a lot of flexibility in the number of shots I'd need to commission and how elaborate they would have to be.

I'd actually feel more comfortable talking with you via email, on my Gmail account (same username), whereby I can describe the project in greater detail to see if it's the sort of thing you'd be interested in (eventually) doing, and haggle over price, and such. If you don't care to do email...like I said, I'm VERY new to LiveJournal, so I'm not sure exactly how this works, and I hope I can figure out where to check for your reply. Thanks!

Re: My Music Video Project

[sigune.livejournal.com]

(Not to worry about checking my reply; it's coming to you all by itself!)

Wow, that does sound like an exciting project :D! I wouldn't say no, but I have to warn you that I have absolutely no experience with animation and I am not a professional artist. Also, I can't take on any projects whatsoever before the new year at the earliest, due to what is my profession - I have a very important deadline to catch :/.

If the above doesn't put you off and you want to mail me about your plans, you can find me at severelysigune [at] yahoo [dot] co [dot] uk :).

Good luck in any case!